How well can you make a chevy vega handle?

[Boostedvega]

I was reading online about vega being one of "the best handling car" america has sold.(at that time of course)

I was wondering when suspension is setup correct how well can it be made to handle?

like would it be comparable to an c5 vette, rx7, wrx, bmw?

or will it still not be competitive enough that you would have to go "all out"

The reason I ask is I have an rx7 suspension set up vega but never drove one in stock form.
It handles great but at the cost of weight.
2860 is a lot more than what I expected it to weight with the rotary swap and a/c heat, PS.

with a vega curb weight of 2300lbs(mines 1971) Its hard to believe that the swap added 560lbs?

[spencerforhire]

If you want to see how well a Vega with minimal suspension mods cam handle, look no further than the "Flying Turd" built by Schwartz Performance. There is a build thread on here somewhere, and the thing kicked ass in both the autocross and road courses.

[spencerforhire]

http://www.schwartzperformance.com/1972 ... ying-turd/

[avewhtboy]

Schwarz is a hell of a driver so he can make anything fast with that said it would be interesting to see what they said about the handling on the car.

I watched him autocross and run in on the Gingerman track and it looked like a handful to me but the times he put down were really good.

Factory castor and camber and ackerman preclude it handling very well. I am sure Schwartz did what he could to correct those but we don't know
what he did. He notes he seem welded the entire engine bay to stiffen it up. The car had a roll cage in it as well so rest assured the body was really stiff.
Thats why they chose the notchback car, for the extra rigidity.

I am autocrossing the blue car in my avatar pics. I will have to say its showing some potential now that I have done a few things to convert it from drag specs
to a more street setup maybe even further than that. I have a 245/35/18 tire in the front and that really seems to help the front stick in the corners. I changed
the steering from manual to power and that made a huge difference. So maybe the "stock" isn't too bad but the setup on your car is at least 20 years newer technology.

[spencerforhire]

I know there are a few others on here(like avewhtboy) that have been to the autocross with their H-body cars; their experiences show that our cars have a lot of potential, but like any 40+ year old car, aren't going to handle like a new Corvette without some serious chassis tuning.
I drove H-bodies for a lot of years, and at that time, there wasn't much of anything coming out of Detroit that felt as good on a twisty road. In the early 80's I had both a 76 Vega GT and a 78 Camaro(with F-41 suspension), the Camaro wallowed like a sow in a sty compared to the nimble Vega. I know we all look back fondly on our glory days with our favorite cars; I'm sure the Vega would feel rather dated now.
The current drag car has kept me too busy to get to my NEXT project; the 77 wagon which will have a bunch of effort put into the suspension in order to make it handle more like it was built in this century.

[cjbiagi]

I think you can get them to handle pretty well with just a good choice of springs, larger front and rear sway bars, a good set of shocks and some larger tires. A good performance alignment will also go a long way to getting them to corner well. Of course rebuilding the suspension with all new bushings and steering components is a necessary starting point.

[cosvega76]

Schwarz is a hell of a driver so he can make anything fast with that said it would be interesting to see what they said about the handling on the car.

I watched him autocross and run in on the Gingerman track and it looked like a handful to me but the times he put down were really good.

Factory castor and camber and ackerman preclude it handling very well. I am sure Schwartz did what he could to correct those but we don't know
what he did. He notes he seem welded the entire engine bay to stiffen it up. The car had a roll cage in it as well so rest assured the body was really stiff.
Thats why they chose the notchback car, for the extra rigidity.

I know Jeff personally, and he is a hell of a driver.

But the Turd did not have a cage in it, only stiffening bars from the firewall to the chassis in the engine compartment. He did the S-10 conversion for the front spindles but kept the stock control arms, using Bob Gumm ball joint spacers. Since it was an all-aluminum LS, it had the stock Vega 4-cylinder springs. He used an Addco front sway bar, moved back in the chassis since he shortened the legs of the bar. The rear bar was from an S-10 Blazer. Although he made rear mounts and upper control arms for the rear suspension, both front and rear suspensions were surprisingly stock.


Chuck

[avewhtboy]

I know Jeff personally, and he is a hell of a driver.

But the Turd did not have a cage in it, only stiffening bars from the firewall to the chassis in the engine compartment. He did the S-10 conversion for the front spindles but kept the stock control arms, using Bob Gumm ball joint spacers. Since it was an all-aluminum LS, it had the stock Vega 4-cylinder springs. He used an Addco front sway bar, moved back in the chassis since he shortened the legs of the bar. The rear bar was from an S-10 Blazer. Although he made rear mounts and upper control arms for the rear suspension, both front and rear suspensions were surprisingly stock.


Chuck

Do you recall what he did for steering I seem to think it was manual steering box but I would have to go back and look at the pictures. The best improvement I may have made so far is going from the stock 1973 manual box to at 1977 power box. That larger tires, larger sway bars and the 450lb springs are really all I did for handling and the car definitely is flat in the corners now. 450lb spring in front 250 lb in rear.

[rpoz-29]

Try 2 degrees of negative camber and 1/8" of toe out. It's a solid axle car so it gets upset on washboard roads. Earlier Vega's didn't have the torque arm rear suspension, and wheel hopped pretty badly. Those alignment specs along with a set of double adjustable Koni shocks and a 1.125" front bar, and 185-60-13 Yokohama A001RS tires helped me win a couple of state titles many years ago in H/Stock. On a smooth course it'll handle with anything, but runs out of engine, (you won't have that issue!), in a stock class.

[cosvega76]

I know Jeff personally, and he is a hell of a driver.

But the Turd did not have a cage in it, only stiffening bars from the firewall to the chassis in the engine compartment. He did the S-10 conversion for the front spindles but kept the stock control arms, using Bob Gumm ball joint spacers. Since it was an all-aluminum LS, it had the stock Vega 4-cylinder springs. He used an Addco front sway bar, moved back in the chassis since he shortened the legs of the bar. The rear bar was from an S-10 Blazer. Although he made rear mounts and upper control arms for the rear suspension, both front and rear suspensions were surprisingly stock.


Chuck

Do you recall what he did for steering I seem to think it was manual steering box but I would have to go back and look at the pictures. The best improvement I may have made so far is going from the stock 1973 manual box to at 1977 power box. That larger tires, larger sway bars and the 450lb springs are really all I did for handling and the car definitely is flat in the corners now. 450lb spring in front 250 lb in rear.

Yes, he ran a manual gearbox. I have a quick ratio power box out of an '86 Monte Carlo SS, I really like it. How does your car ride with those stiff springs?


Chuck

[rpoz-29]

My mistake. I had single adjustable Koni's on the car. I also have an SCCA legal 6 point roll bar in it which also helped.

[Boostedvega]

thanks for the reply guys.

for the guys that track these cars what kind of car would you say its comparable too?

ive seen Schwartz Performance vega before. Didnt know it was for track, i just thought it was for straight line cruiser.
anyone know the weight of that car?

[cosvega76]

I'm not sure on the weight, but since he used the stock '73 springs all the way around it couldn't have weighed much more than stock.


Chuck

[avewhtboy]

My car weighs 2860 with a Iron headed SBC so I would think Schwarz car was a couple hundred pounds less.

quote "How does your car ride with those stiff springs?


Chuck "

With 450 lb front and 250 lb rear springs my car rides pretty good actually. I was worried it would be too stiff but
I am real happy with the front spring rate. Maybe I could go down to 400 but I like the "taughtness" it has now, with
the stiff springs I don't have to worry about bottoming out the car when i hit a bump or dip.

The rear springs may be a little too stiff, I have contemplated going down to 175 lb or so in the rear.

I did drive the car on a 4 hour trip from Atlanta to Pigeon Forge TN and back and the suspension was fine not too
stiff at all. For an 8 hour trip I might feel different.

I am supposed to autocross in a couple weeks at Goodguys show in Charlotte NC. Hope to get some more testing in. The driver sucks but the car is getting better!

[bugdewde]

I was wondering when suspension is setup correct how well can it be made to handle?

like would it be comparable to an c5 vette, rx7, wrx, bmw?

or will it still not be competitive enough that you would have to go "all out"

Stock Vega suspension or your suspension?

If stock Vega..... Comparable to a C5, RX7, WRX or BMW ? I doubt it very seriously. Simply too much advancement in suspension geometries vs the antiquated Vega design to allow for a smooth ride (60's designed) and allow a housewife to negotiate parking lot turns without power steering. The geometries just isn't there on a stock Vega.
Yes, they handle leaps and bounds better than a '70 Impala or Caprice..... but then again, so do most modern battle tanks ..... I said most. https://youtu.be/qnSoxqLHbD8?t=1m50s

-My stock '73 Hatchback was HORRIBLE in it's first-and-only autocross. Placed 14 out of 15. But I LOVED it !!!! It was awesome.
-My mildly modified '73 Kammback wagon is a blast, too. But it's no C5 or BMW, either.
1. 180-horsepower 215ci (3.5L) aluminum V8 weighs 20 lbs more that a stock Vega 2300.... but I have the battery relocated and that negates the 20 lb weight gain.
It also has a probable lower center of gravity, since the stock 2300's 90 lb cast iron head isn't sitting at the top of the engine bay.
So, it retains it "stock" handling characteristics, if not slightly improved.
2. Larger Monza front anti-sway bar, lessens body roll (but needs a larger rear bar).

https://youtu.be/Jl_SCwetGmw

You can see, there's still understeer when coming in hot and even a couple traction issues under power even with 180 HP. It just isn't anything but a 70's grocery getter. But it sure is fun.
So..... don't worry about comparing apples (stock Vega) to oranges (RX7 suspension Vega). Just enjoy it. I sure do.