Front Control Arm question 75 Vega

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Front Control Arm question 75 Vega

Postby dindin » Tue Jul 08, 2014 11:10 am

1975 Vega
Hi All,
I have an issue with getting the 2 rear bolts off the lower control arms, I was thinking of just splitting the nut and getting new bolts and was wondering if anyone has had a problem with cracking these nuts and banging out the bolts?? Also I notice that although I managed to get the nuts off the front camber/caster bolts they seem to not want to come out very easily, any tricks out there?? Everything is apart, and what started out as adjusting my clutch turned into everything in a million pieces and I have still not looked at the clutch yet! LOL

Al
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Re: Front Control Arm question 75 Vega

Postby kgroombr » Tue Jul 08, 2014 11:55 am

Those are some hefty nuts on those bolts and cracking them will be tough. I use a fairly large breaker bar on them, but you have to get it up high enough to use it, but please be safe. I use some 6 ton jack stands that I use (I play it very safe!)

Have you tried some direct heat on them? You will need something that gets really hot. A propane torch is better than nothing, but oxy acetylene is what you really need.

Ken
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Re: Front Control Arm question 75 Vega

Postby bugdewde » Tue Jul 08, 2014 12:09 pm

The nuts will break free with some effort...... but the bolts fuse to the inner bushing sleeve, making the bolt removal the hard part.

Quite possibly the hardest job I've never succeeded at. I literally walked away and didn't complete the job. I was swapping to lower control arms with anti-sway bar mounts...... never got a front bar on that car.
I beat on them with a hammer and twisted them using every tool had.. without success. Very frustrating.

Many years later, I performed the same task on another car with relative ease. Only had to beat one bolt out with a big effing hammer on the nut while a buddy tried twisting the bolt head with a box end wrench.

There are a few posts on here dealing with this issue. Try the search function at top right of the forum.
Seems I recall some folks burning the bushing out, then air chisel the metal sleeves to break them loose from the bolts. Or something like that. A real pain. I'd provide a link to that particular thread but I can't navigate this phone very well.

Other than a major beating with a hammer, maybe some heating and cooling cycles with a torch or trying to rig up a horizontal press of sorts between the front and rear bolts with some all-thread rod or something, I'm all out of ideas. Good luck.... and don't give up. I'm sure someone on here can give better advice.
Dwight

'72 Vega GT Kammback, 215 V8
'73 Vega Wagon - Currently in Limbo....
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Re: Front Control Arm question 75 Vega

Postby hammerdown7 » Tue Jul 08, 2014 12:49 pm

I've used this stuff with good results, http://www.kanolabs.com

Dick
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Re: Front Control Arm question 75 Vega

Postby jgcabriolet » Tue Jul 08, 2014 1:10 pm

On my restoration I had similar issues. What I wound up using to break down the seizure was a really good dose of PB Blaster. Broke the nuts loose with the assistance of a rather long cheater bar on a 3/4 drive breaker bar. After that I used my porta-power with the "butterfly" end to exert pressure against the bolts while turned them. The whole operation was done on my four post lift with the bridge jack holding the body up in the air. It was a long and painful process but wound up with success. I had 2 bushings that the sleeve seized to the bolts and spun the sleeve out of the rubber. OBTW, on a parts car I tried the heat option and wound up with a very stubborn rubber fire from the rubber in the bushings. Oh, and I was completely spent once it was disassembled.

Jack
1976 Vega Sport Coupe with Cabriolet Package
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Re: Front Control Arm question 75 Vega

Postby bugdewde » Tue Jul 08, 2014 3:48 pm

Once the threaded end of the bolt retreats into the body mount, we had to use a drift pin with a hammer to continue beating the bolt out of the arm/mount. It wouldn't simply" unscrew" out.
Dwight

'72 Vega GT Kammback, 215 V8
'73 Vega Wagon - Currently in Limbo....
My rides: http://www.cardomain.com/id/bugdewde
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Re: Front Control Arm question 75 Vega

Postby cjbiagi » Tue Jul 08, 2014 4:17 pm

I ended up cutting mine out, used a sawzall or hack saw blade and cut between the frame and the bushing. Real pain in the ass, if you need new bolts let me know. :dance: cjbiagi@yahoo.com
Clyde.........75 Monza 2+2
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Re: Front Control Arm question 75 Vega

Postby dindin » Tue Jul 08, 2014 5:49 pm

The car if not up high enough for a breaker bar, I will try the oil that Dick suggested first , hopefully I wont have to go the cut method, I have never used a torch and don't wanna practice on this car, my car is not high enough for a breaker to work, and no room for an impact wrench..

I see that front bolts have a shim , do the rear bolts shim up also, I cant really see it very good??

Al
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Re: Front Control Arm question 75 Vega

Postby jgcabriolet » Tue Jul 08, 2014 5:56 pm

That will make it tougher, what you actually see is the cam that is what sets the adjustment i would guess and yes there is one on the bolt head side and behind the lock washer. That is another item that can be seized and be a bit of a challenge.

Jack
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Re: Front Control Arm question 75 Vega

Postby bugdewde » Tue Jul 08, 2014 8:34 pm

I attached a quote from one of my earlier posts where I successfully removed these bolts..... here's what they'll look like fused to the inner sleeve.
Notice how the middle of the bolt is completely dry... after several liberal soakings with penetrating oil. It was just fused in there. Yes, I used Kroil.

bugdewde wrote:Front Suspension Exploration.... checking to see if I can remove the control arm bolts:

Image

Image

7 of the 8 control arm bolts came out with minimal effort. This one, the driver's rearmost lower was fused to the inner sleeve and would not budge. Liberal amounts of penetrant and a large hammer and a brass drift pin eventually drove the cam bolt free!
I had to take a pic of it. It's my first successful removal of the front control arm bolts. I attempted some once before around '95 and was very unsuccessful .......
Dwight

'72 Vega GT Kammback, 215 V8
'73 Vega Wagon - Currently in Limbo....
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Re: Front Control Arm question 75 Vega

Postby Monza Harry » Tue Jul 08, 2014 10:29 pm

My experience years ago is very similar to all of the above! I broke a socket with a breaker bar and a 4' pipe and two "Lard @$$es jumping on it to have to give up and use the torch, and that was every bit as tough as mentioned by everybody here so far! So be Careful this may take some significant torque to move, which is real dangerous on a jack even with stands. I would use the biggest impact gun you can beg borrow or buy with a big torch. I have had pretty good success with the heat and quench method lately, heat both ends with the biggest tip on that torch until "Red" and let it "heat soak" to the inside and then let it cool and spray when warm (400* this is the point that spit will still dance in a ball on the steel) try and use a low flammable spray or just deal with the flames (water) and repeat a few times. What you are trying to accomplish is to have the bolt expand from the heat and break up the rust , and then "draw" the lube in as it cools, not the fastest method but effective. You have to use a lot of heat as you don't want to heat up everything, just the bolt so a small flame from a brazing tip or even a turbo propane torch will not work! They will let everything get hot together as time will let the heat transfer to the bushing and the rubber* (*which you would prefer stay intact to hold onto the bushing so you can hopefully spin the bolt in to free it up so you can remove it without busting up the frame mounts). I hope my explanation is clear to you, my "High Speed Typing" allows me to forget what I am trying to say and sometimes I leave parts out :bang: Harry P.S. WD-40 really burns too well for this method even if you are patient enough to wait for the 400*ish temp! but this what I have so I deal with it, Dick's wonder Oil sounds pretty promising :) I wish I could find it over here in Canada and I forget when I'm in the US I want to try it out.
I'm not a hoarder I'm a preservationist 78 Monza Spyder (~Soon(ish +/- I guess) To Be 2+2 with Spoilers)
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Re: Front Control Arm question 75 Vega

Postby dindin » Wed Jul 16, 2014 10:29 am

Well I got everything but one bolt is stuck to the bushing it seems, feels like it stuck to the shaft , I may have to cut this sucker out, ..are all these bolts the same, or does it matter which one goes where??

I guess I need an alignment if I ever get this done..

Al
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Re: Front Control Arm question 75 Vega

Postby kgroombr » Wed Jul 16, 2014 12:15 pm

All the bolts are the same. You can get brand new replacements at http://www.rockauto.com/ for about $9 each (ACDELCO Part # 45K18018).

Ken
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Re: Front Control Arm question 75 Vega

Postby dindin » Wed Jul 16, 2014 1:08 pm

Ok thanks, that's worth it.

Al
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Re: Front Control Arm question 75 Vega

Postby dindin » Fri Jul 18, 2014 1:20 pm

Well I got the lower control arms off, I managed to unbolt all but one that was seized to the bushing and had to be cut, If I did it over I would have cut them all, much easier than trying to unbolt them..

the weapon of mass destruction was a saw zall, I got 2 blades a carbide grit and a diamond grit, the diamond grit was twice the price so I kept if as my ace in the hole, first cut I used the carbide between the ferrel and bushing, that cut took me about 45 minutes steady pressure at a very slow speed of 2, the next cut I used the diamond grit blade, OMG this blade is awesome, took me about 25 minutes again slow speed steady preassure and a couple minute or 2 breaks for a slug of beer..all in all the diamond grit gets my vote, much easier than I expected..

Al
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