What steering box?

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What steering box?

Postby bruceb » Sat Jan 23, 2016 9:04 pm

I have a 77 Monza power steering car with vega wagon manual box and pitman arm. With some effort it all hooked up but I am not comfortable with it. Is there are manual box and pitman arm that I can actually buy somewhere that will work with the power steering center link and idler arm? I'm sure this has been asked and answered before. I am new to the site. Thanks
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Re: What steering box?

Postby cosvega76 » Sun Jan 24, 2016 7:41 am

The only manual steering box I know of that will work with the power steering pitman arm is one from an S-10. But it has a verrrrry slow ratio. It's easy to turn but takes a lot of turns to achieve it. I'd recommend a Cosworth or later H manual steering box. It has its own spline for a pitman arm, though, so you would need that, as well. Either way, be aware that with the large steering boxes you'll need the power steering centerlink, unless you never changed yours. The small Vega manual steering box uses a unique centerlink.

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Re: What steering box?

Postby monzaaddict » Sun Jan 24, 2016 2:35 pm

If his power steering box has the round top cover he has the correct pitman arm for the large manual box. If he has the power steering box with the square cover than he can use the s10 manual box mentioned. If he now has the small vega manual steering box then it would be simple to just get the vega manual centerlink.
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Re: What steering box?

Postby 77nighthawk » Sun Jan 24, 2016 5:44 pm

I don't know what the s10 ratio is, but I know the Saginaw 525 gearbox has the same dimensions as my power gearbox did, and bolted right in place, using the power steering pitman arm. The Saginaw 525 is something like 24:1 ratio, 6 turns stop to stop. Not the quickest by any means, but a direct bolt in for my application. You can buy one from speedway motors, for about $250 US. They also have some pitman arms, but I don't know if any fit Monza or Vega. I'll post links in a little bit. Brad

Here's the one for my swap:
viewtopic.php?f=10&t=43821

Here's the one for Speedway Motors, direct to gearbox, looks like the price went down a little:
http://www.speedwaymotors.com/1965-1991 ... ,6723.html
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Re: What steering box?

Postby Monza Harry » Sun Jan 24, 2016 11:55 pm

I bought a replacement box for my Sonoma and the only one available at the time was the one I wanted, the one for an "Extreme" model, with a 12.7:1 Ratio. I will compare it to the Monza box to see how close they are. I know I will have some Hose adapting to do as the Sonoma/S10 will have Metric [or is supposed to by all the reading I have found] hose fittings I am sure. Most old school boxes used to be 16:1 in V8 cars (like X Bodies) and SS, and 6 cyl. were 14.7:1 So 12.7 should feel real quick, Clyde had his rebuilt and I believe his new ratio is 12.7:1. IIRC There is a thread here somewhere. Harry Sorry the search won't let me again :?
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Re: What steering box?

Postby chevyart » Tue Jan 26, 2016 7:27 pm

i thought it was OK to use the 76 and up monza manual box or the 75-76 cosworth manual box with its installed pitman arm,(its a larger box), and then it would work and line up correctly with the PS center link(manual center link is diferent), and im sure you would use the PS steering coupler shaft with the 3/4" diameter coupler spline. as the vega box only has a 5/8" diameter knurlized stud coming out of the box. im pretty sure this is the way these parts interchange. i could be wrong art
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Re: What steering box?

Postby cosvega76 » Wed Jan 27, 2016 10:10 am

77nighthawk wrote:I don't know what the s10 ratio is, but I know the Saginaw 525 gearbox has the same dimensions as my power gearbox did, and bolted right in place, using the power steering pitman arm. The Saginaw 525 is something like 24:1 ratio, 6 turns stop to stop. Not the quickest by any means, but a direct bolt in for my application. You can buy one from speedway motors, for about $250 US. They also have some pitman arms, but I don't know if any fit Monza or Vega. I'll post links in a little bit. Brad

Here's the one for my swap:
viewtopic.php?f=10&t=43821

Here's the one for Speedway Motors, direct to gearbox, looks like the price went down a little:
http://www.speedwaymotors.com/1965-1991 ... ,6723.html


Brad,

I'm curious how far up the spline that power steering pitman arm fit on that manual box compared to the power steering spline. The blueprints I'm looking at for '68 - '74 Novas (which would use the same steering boxes) show a small end of taper dimension for the spline of 0.992" tip-to-tip and 1.061" valley-to-valley for the manual box vs. 1.100" tip-to-tip and 1.181" valley-to-valley smaller end of the spline taper for the power box. I would think a spline dimension of .100" larger would place the pitman arm higher on the spline. Whether that would affect the nut position and clamping force, or the side-to-side alignment of the centerlink, I don't know.

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Re: What steering box?

Postby monzaaddict » Wed Jan 27, 2016 11:42 am

Again there are 2 different power steering boxes that were used on h bodies.

The 605 series with the round top cover and the 800 series with the square 4 bolt top cover.

77nighthawk had the 605 series box which uses the same steering arm as the large cosworth 525 manual box.

The 800 series box has a steering arm will bolt to the s10 manual steering box.
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Re: What steering box?

Postby bruceb » Wed Jan 27, 2016 6:41 pm

My 77 Monza was a power steer car. The power steer box and pitman are long gone. The power center link remains. Vega wagon manual box and pitman arm bolted right in. As I recall ,the center link had to be pushed up a good bit to fit and castle nut. A force fit. That was done a few years back and I am no longer comfortable with it. If I got a 525 box what pitman arm could be used? It would have to be offset some I think.
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Re: What steering box?

Postby chevyart » Thu Jan 28, 2016 9:15 am

bruce. why dont you try for one of the boxes i mentioned in my post above. probably one of out members would have one of those boxes for sale, with pitman arm already installed. . you may want to check your current centerlink and make sure nothing is worn out from the way you said it was installed before. good luck art
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Re: What steering box?

Postby 77nighthawk » Thu Jan 28, 2016 10:54 pm

cosvega76 wrote:
77nighthawk wrote:I don't know what the s10 ratio is, but I know the Saginaw 525 gearbox has the same dimensions as my power gearbox did, and bolted right in place, using the power steering pitman arm. The Saginaw 525 is something like 24:1 ratio, 6 turns stop to stop. Not the quickest by any means, but a direct bolt in for my application. You can buy one from speedway motors, for about $250 US. They also have some pitman arms, but I don't know if any fit Monza or Vega. I'll post links in a little bit. Brad<br abp="762"><br abp="763">Here's the one for my swap:<br abp="764">http://forums.h-body.org/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=43821<br abp="765"><br abp="766">Here's the one for Speedway Motors, direct to gearbox, looks like the price went down a little:<br abp="767">http://www.speedwaymotors.com/1965-1991-GM-525-Manual-Steering-Box-w-3-4-30-Input-Spline,6723.html
<br abp="768"><br abp="769">Brad,<br abp="770"><br abp="771">I'm curious how far up the spline that power steering pitman arm fit on that manual box compared to the power steering spline. The blueprints I'm looking at for '68 - '74 Novas (which would use the same steering boxes) show a small end of taper dimension for the spline of 0.992" tip-to-tip and 1.061" valley-to-valley for the manual box vs. 1.100" tip-to-tip and 1.181" valley-to-valley smaller end of the spline taper for the power box. I would think a spline dimension of .100" larger would place the pitman arm higher on the spline. Whether that would affect the nut position and clamping force, or the side-to-side alignment of the centerlink, I don't know.<br abp="772"><br abp="773">Chuck

Hey Chuck, my pitman arm fit the 525 exactly the same as the power unit. I didn't take a picture, but I compared the 2 sets of splines with my calipers, before I installed the pitman arm on the 525, and they were the same. The nut, once torqued, was .0005 closer to the end of the splined shaft. Brad
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Re: What steering box?

Postby TOM71VEGA » Sat Jan 30, 2016 9:49 pm

There is a place on Ebay that is selling the 20 to 1 Vega steering boxes, it is called CPP
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Re: What steering box?

Postby cosvega76 » Sun Jan 31, 2016 8:59 am

Brad,

I'm not that familiar with the 525 box, I don't remember those on H's, I thought they started installing them on the downsized Malibus and such in the early 80s. Glad it worked out for you.


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Re: What steering box?

Postby monzaaddict » Mon Feb 01, 2016 3:25 am

525 is the large cosworth manual box
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Re: What steering box?

Postby cosvega76 » Mon Feb 01, 2016 10:31 am

Oops - that would be the 605 power steering box, wouldn't it? That'll teach me for responding so early on a Sunday!


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