E85 Carb MN

[NixVegaGT]

I was just surfing for random stuff the other night. I've been thinking about running E85 again. The deciding factor will be what my CR specs out to. If I'm running more that 11:1 I figure I'm going to do it. ANyway I remembered seeing that a local (MN) company that builds them so I searched a sec and found them. They make E85 carbs for race and street.

They are actually pretty well priced! Here's a link:

http://www.e85carbs.com/index.htm

I'm looking at the E85 Race 650. COOL!

http://www.e85carbs.com/products.htm

[MIKESMONZA]

Nix ;Nice Site,,
May be the way in the future,,,,

My kids invested in a Late Model used Loaded Tahoe with SBC 5.3 all aluminumn Block and Head's
with the,,E85 Option Dual Fuel ,

They have told Me it get's better Gas Milage with the Regular Gas, at full price.,Set Up.
But when they buy one or two tanks of E85 it gets Less Gas Milage,at a Reduced Per gallon Price,

Hope they Improve on the Milage Benefit on E85 in the Future,
As They have Sunk a lot of Money in the Processing of Corn,,
,And have made a lot of Surplus CornGrower's Switch their Crops production,
to the Favored Style of Corn Ear Hybrid,,,,,

It Also drives up the price of Food Corn, Cause The Farmers are getting less per Acre Planted,
and hits us in the pocket book at the grocery,Corn by the Ear,Corn oil, Corn meal,Corn totillas,Corn starche,canned corn,Pop corn,Corn Shucks
,,,Cattle is Raised on Corn, Meat
Hogs Also,Meat Bacon
Deer Raised in Ranche's in Argentina,
also used to feed Chickens,and other Live Stock,,

Here in Texas We have Corn Eaten by Deer Some times at a Convieance Store out front,
Straight from the Bag, I witnesed a Bunch of Deer,5 Does and a Buck standing by The Automated Door's,,
Ducking their heads in to something,,Big 100 LB Bags
And looking at me while I Filled my truck with Diesel, Went in to pay at Cashier,
and Noticed The bags had Hole's Torn in them,, Corn Flowing out ,,she said Excuse the Mess,,

"They" start feeding at two thirty AM ,,,every Morning
,,,,,I smiled and said It was a great sight,,, Dad and his Girl's out for a Early Breakfast, Yumn Deer Corn.

Just think Maybe some day on Spike TV ,,Trucks,,,they will sell a Kit To make Your Own Corn,,,,E 85+
But maybe we can get some Serious disscussion on this E-85 Fuel going, Mike

[NixVegaGT]

I'm with you man. I think they shouldn't make it from corn. It's just not as efficient. OR make it from a bunch of things. Why not use some sugar beets? I'm hoping there will be more development in the cellulose-based ethanol. That could yield 5x the output of the energy put in, easy!

I figure while it's there I'll use it. It's cheaper than racing fuel and does almost as well when the engine is optimized for it, meaning much higher compression and longer spark advance. I'm betting longer rod ratios would help too but that's just speculation on my part because it seems logical that a longer dwell time at TDC would help the flame propagation with a cooler fuel better.

[73astregt]

hey nic not to put a damper on your plans but have you checked out the availability of e85 or a suitable replacement if you still plan to do the targa nfld race? i know i mentioned it b4 but...

[spyder_xlch]

Aren't the E85 carbs set up similar to an Alky carb? And speaking of Alky, is it legal to distill your own fuel as long as you don't drink it?

[NixVegaGT]

Maybe I'll just distill a big bunch of alcohol and haul it across the border! LOL!

Good point... Hmmmm. Something to think about.

I think it is legal to distill as long as you don't sell it or transport it. I think it's funny that we transport it everywhere in our gas tanks!! PERFECT!

[res0o7eb]

My kids invested in a Late Model used Loaded Tahoe with SBC 5.3 all aluminumn Block and Head's...

GM does not produce a Small Block Chevrolet engine anymore.

They have told Me it get better Gas Milage with the Regular Gas, at full price.,Set Up.
But when they buy one or two tanks of E85 it gets Less Gas Milage,at a Reduced Per gallon Price

I hope the dealers aren't spreading lies about E85. E85 Fuel Mileage will never match the Fuel Mileage of gasoline. Ethanol doesn't have the same amount of energy as gasoline and it takes more E85 per volume of air just to burn it in your engine's combustion chamber - something like 9.6 parts air to 1 part E85 versus 14.7 parts air to 1 part gasoline. E85 should be priced accordingly so that the cost per mile is the same as gasoline.

What E85 allows is the ability to run higher compression in the engine and therefore generate more power than a similarly-sized gasoline engine. So, ideally a smaller displacement engine can be used to generate the same power as that 5.3 LS-something engine in your kids truck. A smaller displacement engine consumes less fuel overall. The only way that E85-based engine will potentially be able to deliver better fuel mileage than a gasoline engine is to use power output for comparison. Very much like the marine industry uses. In the future, I can see that automakers won't specify an engine by it's displacement, but by its power and fuel cost per mile. You'll order a 300-HP engine that costs 10 cents per mile to operate. You can specify whether you want to burn gasoline or E85.

[spyder_xlch]

I'm puzzled about the dual fuel engines. Like Tom said E85 can handle more compression. You'd probably would get better mileage if the compression ratio was higher. The engine has to run richer on E85. How does the computer compensate for this? Do you flip a switch when you run E85 to make it run richer? And what about the compression ratio? You can't change that with a flip of the switch. Or does varriable valve timing help bump the compression up? I don't think you could make the engine run at it's best in a dual fuel situation. I'd think you'd have to pick what fuel you want to run and build accordingly (like Nic is doing).

[MIKESMONZA]

Thanks for the replys to my reply to Nics Post,
Some where along the line, GM forgot to send Me the Reminder,
No More SBC's being Produced,,LOL,,
Seriously
I am In a Lack of info Mode,,Thanks for the Update,
I get a little Confused,,,,,
With all of the Gen 1 and now Gen 2 and 3,
,,,,And now LT1,,,,LT 4
LS1 , LS2, LS's 4 thru 7 ,,???
LSX
All of these New Engines have advantages of Newer technolgy's,
and Should be great on Horsepower,TorQue,and Faster Aceleration ,

And if they can Run on Ethanol E85,and Pump Gas
,or Sugar Cane ,Sugarbeet, "BEETJUICE",
Maybe even Fermented Cranberry's Juice,,,
Mike

[res0o7eb]

Mike,
Heh-heh. Nothing personal.
Just my mission to eradicate the Chevy-centric thinking regarding the current GM product line of engines.
We are in a different era, now.
Because the SBC was the last of the 'legacy' GM V-8's to be eliminated, most people think the LS1/LS2 is a Chevrolet small block engine. Some call it a Gen III, but it has almost nothing in common with the SBC. The SBC has not been offered in a production automobile in 4 or 5 years. think
The Chevrolet small block V-8 was called that when Chevrolet had two distinct V-8 engine lines. There needs to be no distinction between a small block and a big block anymore as Chevrolet has only one V-8 engine.

If anything, the current LS-series is just a Chevrolet V-8. Of course, it is just as much a Pontiac or Buick engine, too. So, it is a GM V-8.
GM refers to its various engines differently, now, that doesn't involve the name of its divisions, the displacement of the engine, or the relative size of the block. We should all become more familiar with that nomenclature.

[NixVegaGT]

Dual fuel use has always confused me for a power plant that isn't forced induction. With forced induction you can increase boost 3x and still have no detonation. SO in a car with a turbo you could have the fuel curve change to 9.6:1 advance the timing by 20º and increase boost to like 24 psi. Then it would be worth it. Otherwise you're just wasting E85 by dumping it into an engine optimized for gasoline. Strange behavior.

The conspiracy theorist side of me is suspect of a bunch of manufacturer behaviors. Plug-in hybrids for instance. How many years for the Chevy Volt to come out?? WTF! Toyota is already building them and they aren't for sale in America because of bureaucratic BS. Smells like PAC lobbies to me. I say get'em over here! More gas for the hobbyists! RIGHT!?

[MIKESMONZA]

,,I did a little search for E85 fuel Improvements,
Found a page with several E85 Applications,

Jay Lenos Garage was Great he had a InterView with Gale Banks,,,,The Turbo Man,,,,
where The subject of how and Why,,

I.E. Dual Fuel Car's are Optimized for Gasoline,
But If you Optimize it For E85 and had a Good Supply,
it would be a Great Fuel and Could be Carbed, Injected, and Turbocharged , with Great Result's.

They also mentioned that the E85 has To be Tanker Trucked in, In California For Example
It can not be pushed into a Pipeline Like Gas,,,
,, because it pick's up Water and Condensation in Pipe Line Transportation,

But they are Building a Plant in California to Help With Demand, (In Future)
Check it out,,

Also there was a section on; E85 Use in Non Flex Fuel Vehicles,
Interesting read, have not finished with it all,

Wikipedia has Article also with info on non FFV engines, and Carbed Units,
,also,,,,Turbocharged FI units,
Wanted to Share with all of you,,,, A.S.A.P.
Mike

[NixVegaGT]

Thanks Mike. I'm kinda hoping the development continues on the use. I'm hoping they will start making it with Hemp and Switchgrass soon. Those two sources have WAY more yield because of the almost non-existent need for herbicides, pesticides or fertilizer. They just don't need it. Tons of money to be saved there.

[MIKESMONZA]

Thanks Mike. I'm kinda hoping the development continues on the use. I'm hoping they will start making it with Hemp and Switchgrass soon. Those two sources have WAY more yield because of the almost non-existent need for herbicides, pesticides or fertilizer. They just don't need it. Tons of money to be saved there.

Hemp and Switch grass?
,,,,,Texas Local MariJuana Pickers Union,,,Member's Represensatives
are on the Phone asking when they could Expect the Market Boom ,
,,,and are curently gearing up getting Personel Signed In.

Will Switch Grass will be Easy,,????
Mike

[NixVegaGT]

Heck yeah! Pot85. That stuff would work great. It grows like a weed. I think we should use it. Seriously all the luck in the world to anybody attempting to get high from a hemp cigarette. It would have to be the size of a telephone pole. And if we did use Marijuana for ethanol think of the economic boom southern West VA would get if we were making fuel from the pot they grow! Exponential client base growth.