00041mile COSWORTH !!

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00041mile COSWORTH !!

Postby h-bot » Sat Dec 28, 2002 9:44 am

From: bobsabuyer_REMOVE_879405_THIS_@yahoo.com

Hello Group,
I have a Black 1976 Cosworth Vega with 00041 ACTUAL MILES ! Maybe
it is the lowest mileage Vega in existence. Would love to know if
anyone knows of one lower. I will help anybody that needs to know
anything about originality of a Cosworth. It is untouched. Let me
know what you need to know, and I'll go down in the garage and take a
look.
I may be selling it soon. Mid teens is the price range. Please don't
write me and tell me that it is too much money. With 41 miles it is
in a price range of it's own. Imagine what it would be worth if it
was a Camaro SS or Chevelle SS big block!Probably would bring
$100,000! I think this car is going to be worth some serious money in
the not to distant future. I am moving and downsizing. Can't take
everything or I wouldn't give this one up.
Have a Happy and Prosperous New Year.
Rob





[This is message #10124 by user bobsabuyer on Yahoo! Group Cosworth Vegas: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/cosworthvegas ]
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00041mile COSWORTH !!

Postby h-bot » Sat Dec 28, 2002 12:23 pm

From: doctorduke_REMOVE_445754_THIS_@yahoo.com

An "new" CV pops up at the major auctions every few months, usually a
never registered car still on MSO, and I expect there are between one
and two dozen such cars out there. They typically go for about $10K.
I recall a Chevrolet dealer from the midwest who advertised a "new" CV
in CV Magazine for something like three years for a mid teens asking
price. I think he finally sold it at one of the classic auctions for
a lot less than what he was asking. I'm suspicious of these cars
because if the fuel system was not drained, dried, and treated with a
rust inhibitor, they could have serious fuel system varnish and/or
corrosion.

Likewise with the cooling system. If the cooling system was not
drained and dried they likely have serious cooling system corrosion if
the original antifreeze is still in place. I heard that the orange
"new" CV that was at the '99 Roundup in Las Vegas blew out the head
gasket a year later due to corrosion at the top of the cylinder
barrels, which is the typical failure mechanism for cars that have not
had adequate cooling system maintenance.

The deal with antifreeze and brake fluid is that the clock runs from
the time they are filled regardless of whether the engine is ever
started and the car is driven.

It's too bad, but it appears that most of these cars did not receive
any thoughtful longe term storage preparation, so they could have some
very serious gremlins hiding in the woodwork so to speak that will
create some serious repair costs.

Caveat Emptor!

Duke




[This is message #10126 by user doctorduke on Yahoo! Group Cosworth Vegas: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/cosworthvegas ]
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00041mile COSWORTH !!

Postby h-bot » Sun Dec 29, 2002 6:42 am

From: twincams_REMOVE_451939_THIS_@yahoo.com

--- In <a href="/group/cosworthvegas/post?protectID=219233066105193209050199029077192253163098100009128121188190230091025019053061151110147">cosworthvegas@yahoogroups.com</a>, "bobsabuyer <<a href="/group/cosworthvegas/post?protectID=014233250112158202130097163148114164071048139">bobsabuyer@y...</a>>"
<<a href="/group/cosworthvegas/post?protectID=014233250112158202130097163148114164071048139">bobsabuyer@y...</a>> wrote:
> Hello Group,
> I have a Black 1976 Cosworth Vega with 00041 ACTUAL MILES ! Maybe
> it is the lowest mileage Vega in existence.

Rob

I think Dan McNally has a 76 with 27 miles on the odometer.

Later

Tim




[This is message #10130 by user twincams on Yahoo! Group Cosworth Vegas: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/cosworthvegas ]
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00041mile COSWORTH !!

Postby h-bot » Fri Jan 03, 2003 6:30 am

From: dancv32_REMOVE_780563_THIS_@yahoo.com

Duke,

You have stated numersous times your philosphy that low mileage or
not properly maintained CV's will suffer from cylinder corrosion at
the top of the bores. I think you are making a blanket statement
that cannot be supported by FACTS. To date, Tima and I have taken a
number of engines removed from both running and nonrunning vehicles.
This condition is not usually the case. I am running a car that was
in storage for nine years and it has not blown a head gasket as yet.
I also have a cv that was in storage for eight years and due to my
own stupidity of dropping a foreign object in the cylinder, the head
had to be removed. However this one did have erosion around the bore
of one cylinder but still sealed properly.

You are both right and wrong in your statement. One will never know
what condition the bores are in until a tear down is performed. I
will agree that IT IS POSSIBLE for erosion to occur, but to make a
blanket statement that it will occur is doing everyone a dis-
service. As Tim Morgan and I can report, we have had no failures of
head gaskets on our low mileage cosworths.

As for the orange CV in TX. I do not recall all of the events around
the head gasket problem. But the car sit for over a year after the
gentleman passed away and started right up when pulled from the
garage. The only problem was a split fuel line at the rail
connection. The car runs great with no apparent problems. I suspect
that there is more to the story of the head gasket. When the head
gasket blew out, Randy had driven less than 100 miles since his time
of purchase. It is possible that a factory defect or an assembly
error occured, who knows. Only a teardown would reveal the condition
of the bores.

Dan

--- In <a href="/group/cosworthvegas/post?protectID=219233066105193209050199029077192253163098100009128121188190230091025019053061151110147">cosworthvegas@yahoogroups.com</a>, doctorduke <<a href="/group/cosworthvegas/post?protectID=091233212180056219138097203245129208071">no_reply@y...</a>>
wrote:
> An "new" CV pops up at the major auctions every few months, usually
a
> never registered car still on MSO, and I expect there are between
one
> and two dozen such cars out there. They typically go for about
$10K.
> I recall a Chevrolet dealer from the midwest who advertised a "new"
CV
> in CV Magazine for something like three years for a mid teens
asking
> price. I think he finally sold it at one of the classic auctions
for
> a lot less than what he was asking. I'm suspicious of these cars
> because if the fuel system was not drained, dried, and treated with
a
> rust inhibitor, they could have serious fuel system varnish and/or
> corrosion.
>
> Likewise with the cooling system. If the cooling system was not
> drained and dried they likely have serious cooling system corrosion
if
> the original antifreeze is still in place. I heard that the orange
> "new" CV that was at the '99 Roundup in Las Vegas blew out the head
> gasket a year later due to corrosion at the top of the cylinder
> barrels, which is the typical failure mechanism for cars that have
not
> had adequate cooling system maintenance.
>
> The deal with antifreeze and brake fluid is that the clock runs
from
> the time they are filled regardless of whether the engine is ever
> started and the car is driven.
>
> It's too bad, but it appears that most of these cars did not
receive
> any thoughtful longe term storage preparation, so they could have
some
> very serious gremlins hiding in the woodwork so to speak that will
> create some serious repair costs.
>
> Caveat Emptor!
>
> Duke




[This is message #10157 by user dancv32 on Yahoo! Group Cosworth Vegas: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/cosworthvegas ]
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00041mile COSWORTH !!

Postby h-bot » Fri Jan 03, 2003 8:58 am

From: rondeau3_REMOVE_364034_THIS_@yahoo.com

--- In <a href="/group/cosworthvegas/post?protectID=219233066105193209050199029077192253163098100009128121188190230091025019053061151110147">cosworthvegas@yahoogroups.com</a>, dancv32 <<a href="/group/cosworthvegas/post?protectID=091233212180056219138097203245129208071">no_reply@y...</a>> wrote:
> Duke,
>
> You have stated numersous times your philosphy that low mileage or
> not properly maintained CV's will suffer from cylinder corrosion
at
> the top of the bores.

>I am running a car that was
> in storage for nine years and it has not blown a head gasket as
yet.
> I also have a cv that was in storage for eight years

Seems like you're about 20 years short of what Duke was talking
about.

9 Years of storage when Duke was talking about 27 years for a 75
with "0" miles and no maintenance.

Am I missing something here?

Al




[This is message #10159 by user rondeau3 on Yahoo! Group Cosworth Vegas: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/cosworthvegas ]
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00041mile COSWORTH !!

Postby h-bot » Fri Jan 03, 2003 9:23 am

From: doctorduke_REMOVE_585411_THIS_@yahoo.com

Disservice? Blanket statements? Take a valium, Dan!

Based on my own personal observations of eroded cylinder barrels and
water pump castings with holes in them, there is a significant risk of
serious internal corrosion damage if the antifreeze is not renewed
periodicially. You did not say how often you change the antifreeze in
your cars, or whether you know their complete cooling system service
histories, but the less frequent the changes, the greater the risk of
damage. The highest risk of damage would be a "zero mile" car that
still has the factory installed anti-freeze, and they are out there.
There is also risk of damage for cars in service if they have gone for
long periods without proper cooling system maintenance, and many cars
currently in service have spent a considerable amount of time dormant
- most likely with old antifreeze in them. They, too, are at risk.

Aluminum is much less forgiving of poor cooling system maintenance
than cast iron. Paricularly if a car was stored from new, there is a
significant risk of cooling system damage if the antifreeze was not
either drained or periodically renewed. The clock runs on antifreeze
(and brake fluid) even if the car is not operated.

This is something that a potential buyer should consider, especially
when considering a car that has been "stored" for a long time. Few
owners bother with proper long term storage preparation. As these
cars age, the risk of significant cooling system corrosion damage
increases, so current owners should change anti-freeze at least every
two years, regardless of mileage. It's a fairly simple job.

Also, there is a simple way to test for the amount of electrolytic
corrosion activity in a cooling system. With a good quality digital
voltmeter that reads to 1 millivolt, place the postive probe in the
coolant and the negative probe on the battery negative terminal.
Effective corrosion protection is indicated by a voltage reading of
no more than about 250 MV.. If it is greater than 500 mV there is
significant electolytic corrosion activity. This procedure only tests
the current rate of corrosion activity. It does not tell you what, if
any, damage has occured, but if the current rate of electolytic
corrosion activity is high the chance that there is damage is likely
greater.

If there is evidence or corrosion activity, the potential buyer should
query the owner about cooling system maintenance. IMO nothing beats
actual service record documentation, but few owners maintain much if
any meaningful service documentation.

As always, when buying ANY vintage car:

CAVEAT EMPTOR!

Duke










[This is message #10160 by user doctorduke on Yahoo! Group Cosworth Vegas: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/cosworthvegas ]
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