Gm mini starter again

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Gm mini starter again

Postby 201 72 vega gt » Tue Sep 06, 2016 11:03 pm

Hello, I have installed a Gm mini starter from a later Gm p/u in my 350 conversion. the starter only has 1 small wire hookup,I have 2 wires, one purple and one brown with a yellow attached to it going up to the + side of coil. I'm hoping for a simple solution!!
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Re: Gm mini starter again

Postby Monza Harry » Wed Sep 07, 2016 2:32 am

Your extra wire [purple I think] is for the start feature on the fuel pump This is to prime the carb for starting. You will need the solenoid from a pre electronic ignition GM starter that wire goes to the "IGN" terminal, I don't know if you can just switch the cap on the solenoid or not, I just haven't played with that much. Someone else will know for sure stay tuned: Same H Channel Same H Time... Harry
I'm not a hoarder I'm a preservationist 78 Monza Spyder (Soon To Be 2+2 with Spoilers)
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Re: Gm mini starter again

Postby spencerforhire » Wed Sep 07, 2016 6:32 am

The purple is the "start" wire from the key. The yellow/brown is the full 12 volt feed to the coil during cranking. If you still have points(shame on you if you do), then you will have to find another way to do this. You could look for a different solenoid, but it can be done with a relay. If you have upgraded to some form of electronic ignition(Pertronix, etc.) then disregard this wire.
The "fleet"-
77 Vega Estate wagon- project(someday)will have TPI305/T-5, S-10 spindles/axles
72 Vega HB Drag Car -383/'Glide/9"(9.35@146.19)(5.94@117.28 1/8th)
76 Vega GT- 400/4spd/9" retired from active duty(rusty)
03 Silverado 2WD ex.cab (work truck/parts hauler)
04 Silverado 2WD ex.cab (retired)
06 Haulin' 20ft enclosed car transporter
93 Suburban- 350/4L60(retired)
00 Saturn SW2- wife's car
01 Saturn SC2- younger son's project
00 Saturn SL2- daughter's car
98 Saturn SW2- spare
and 3 more Saturn "parts cars"
Note- the very act of listing all of these has made me realize I have some kind of problem.....

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Re: Gm mini starter again

Postby 201 72 vega gt » Wed Sep 07, 2016 10:49 pm

Thanks Spenser,my distributor has been converted to a pointless unit so I'll ignore the brown/yellow, that's the smoothest thing so far on this project except the grommet that came with my oil pressure fit an existing hole in my firewall! Thanks again.
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Re: Gm mini starter again

Postby spencerforhire » Thu Sep 08, 2016 6:32 am

Odd that this would come up this week; yesterday, I installed a Pertronix electronic ignition conversion in a 1972 'Vette. Partly because the customer wanted to buy a mini starter from me, and I told him the points had to go first. The car had a 454 with a few aftermarket goodies, and I was told it had never started well in the 17 years the guy had owned it. Starter had been changed a couple of times, underhood and underdash wiring harnesses were replaced; customer had had the car to a few different places and nobody could get it to start or for that matter, run properly. I changed the ignition(had to rebuild the tach drive distributor as it had almost 1/4" of vertical play in the shaft) and starter, fixed a bunch of stuff that was wired improperly, and told him to drive it and see how it worked. Got a phone call later that evening telling me "the car has NEVER started or run this well in the 17 years he's had it". Next step is to convince him to pitch the grossly undersized 600 Holley carb for something that will let that BBC breathe.
I'm a bit off topic here, but I'm just trying to illustrate how good these little starters work.
The "fleet"-
77 Vega Estate wagon- project(someday)will have TPI305/T-5, S-10 spindles/axles
72 Vega HB Drag Car -383/'Glide/9"(9.35@146.19)(5.94@117.28 1/8th)
76 Vega GT- 400/4spd/9" retired from active duty(rusty)
03 Silverado 2WD ex.cab (work truck/parts hauler)
04 Silverado 2WD ex.cab (retired)
06 Haulin' 20ft enclosed car transporter
93 Suburban- 350/4L60(retired)
00 Saturn SW2- wife's car
01 Saturn SC2- younger son's project
00 Saturn SL2- daughter's car
98 Saturn SW2- spare
and 3 more Saturn "parts cars"
Note- the very act of listing all of these has made me realize I have some kind of problem.....

Visit http://www.spencerforhire.ca
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Re: Gm mini starter again

Postby 201 72 vega gt » Thu Sep 08, 2016 3:42 pm

My pointless coversion is a Crane, hope it works, it was already intsalled by the previous owner of the engine, off topic again.Thanks again.
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Re: Gm mini starter again

Postby 201 72 vega gt » Fri Sep 09, 2016 10:51 am

Was pondering your solution to my problem, if I exclude the brown/yellow wire how does the coil get power?
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Re: Gm mini starter again

Postby spencerforhire » Fri Sep 09, 2016 8:49 pm

Normally, the coil gets power through the resistance wire(white with a braided cotton cover) which supplies 6-8 volts while running. During crank, the extra wire(usually yellow, attached to a terminal marked "I") on the starter bumps that up to 12 volts. With any kind of electronic ignition upgrade(pertronix, Crane, even a GM HEI), the resistance wire is supposed to be replaced with a proper, full voltage wire. I like to pull the bulkhead connector apart at the firewall and replace the resistance wire with a fresh piece of 14ga. wire. Alternately, a new wire can be run in to under the dash and plugged into a spare ignition spade in the fuse box.
On a Vega, full voltage can also be found at the large pink wire on the oil pressure switch.
The "fleet"-
77 Vega Estate wagon- project(someday)will have TPI305/T-5, S-10 spindles/axles
72 Vega HB Drag Car -383/'Glide/9"(9.35@146.19)(5.94@117.28 1/8th)
76 Vega GT- 400/4spd/9" retired from active duty(rusty)
03 Silverado 2WD ex.cab (work truck/parts hauler)
04 Silverado 2WD ex.cab (retired)
06 Haulin' 20ft enclosed car transporter
93 Suburban- 350/4L60(retired)
00 Saturn SW2- wife's car
01 Saturn SC2- younger son's project
00 Saturn SL2- daughter's car
98 Saturn SW2- spare
and 3 more Saturn "parts cars"
Note- the very act of listing all of these has made me realize I have some kind of problem.....

Visit http://www.spencerforhire.ca
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1972 Chevrolet Vega Hatchback

Re: Gm mini starter again

Postby 201 72 vega gt » Sat Sep 10, 2016 11:31 am

I'm not useing the oil pressure sending unit so I can just pull the pink wire through and run it to the plus side of the coil?
201 72 vega gt
 
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Joined: Fri Apr 10, 2015 9:14 pm

Re: Gm mini starter again

Postby spencerforhire » Sat Sep 10, 2016 4:43 pm

Yes. but if you're using an electric fuel pump, using the OEM oil pressure switch is not a bad idea for safety.
The "fleet"-
77 Vega Estate wagon- project(someday)will have TPI305/T-5, S-10 spindles/axles
72 Vega HB Drag Car -383/'Glide/9"(9.35@146.19)(5.94@117.28 1/8th)
76 Vega GT- 400/4spd/9" retired from active duty(rusty)
03 Silverado 2WD ex.cab (work truck/parts hauler)
04 Silverado 2WD ex.cab (retired)
06 Haulin' 20ft enclosed car transporter
93 Suburban- 350/4L60(retired)
00 Saturn SW2- wife's car
01 Saturn SC2- younger son's project
00 Saturn SL2- daughter's car
98 Saturn SW2- spare
and 3 more Saturn "parts cars"
Note- the very act of listing all of these has made me realize I have some kind of problem.....

Visit http://www.spencerforhire.ca
User avatar
spencerforhire
 
Posts: 2394
Joined: Mon Jul 03, 2006 9:02 pm
Location: Halifax, Nova Scotia

1972 Chevrolet Vega Hatchback

Re: Gm mini starter again

Postby Monza Harry » Sat Sep 10, 2016 8:09 pm

spencerforhire wrote:Yes. but if you're using an electric fuel pump, using the OEM oil pressure switch is not a bad idea for safety.

I'll second that! I know that both GM and F :censored: D both use some variation of an emergency shut off for the same reason with any Electric Pumped vehicle, IDK about Mopar but, I would think they would have come to the same conclusion from gov't mandated testing as a car that has crashed sitting there with the fuel pump running and the engine off isn't anybody's favourite plan! If this can't be made to work easily with your starter you could just add a "Prime Button" to your Electric fuel pump circuit, or run a wire from the windings connection on the starter to the Electric pump but that will require a "Diode" to prevent the fuel pump circuit from trying to run the starter. I am sure Spencer could supply that for you. Harry
I'm not a hoarder I'm a preservationist 78 Monza Spyder (Soon To Be 2+2 with Spoilers)
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1978 Chevrolet Monza 2+2

Re: Gm mini starter again

Postby 201 72 vega gt » Sat Sep 10, 2016 11:08 pm

I'm. Using the old fashion mechanical fuel pump, I wanna keep original! LOL.
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Re: Gm mini starter again

Postby spencerforhire » Sun Sep 11, 2016 8:35 am

I'm used to electric pumps; never had room in any of my street V8 Vegas for a mechanical. All mine had OEM Monza mounts.
The "fleet"-
77 Vega Estate wagon- project(someday)will have TPI305/T-5, S-10 spindles/axles
72 Vega HB Drag Car -383/'Glide/9"(9.35@146.19)(5.94@117.28 1/8th)
76 Vega GT- 400/4spd/9" retired from active duty(rusty)
03 Silverado 2WD ex.cab (work truck/parts hauler)
04 Silverado 2WD ex.cab (retired)
06 Haulin' 20ft enclosed car transporter
93 Suburban- 350/4L60(retired)
00 Saturn SW2- wife's car
01 Saturn SC2- younger son's project
00 Saturn SL2- daughter's car
98 Saturn SW2- spare
and 3 more Saturn "parts cars"
Note- the very act of listing all of these has made me realize I have some kind of problem.....

Visit http://www.spencerforhire.ca
User avatar
spencerforhire
 
Posts: 2394
Joined: Mon Jul 03, 2006 9:02 pm
Location: Halifax, Nova Scotia

1972 Chevrolet Vega Hatchback

Re: Gm mini starter again

Postby 201 72 vega gt » Mon Sep 12, 2016 1:02 am

I'm running stock plates also just trimmed them up a bit to clear the mechanical fuel pump. I had to use a 90 degree at the pump for the fuel line to clear the steering link though. I have plenty of clearance there but my Sanderson headers hit the shock tower on the right side! I guess I'll have to notch it and weld a piece in. Off topic again. Thanks again.
201 72 vega gt
 
Posts: 23
Joined: Fri Apr 10, 2015 9:14 pm


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